Thank you for writing the one newsletter on Taylor’s engagement that I didn’t feel like cringing away from.
A thought I wanted to share – I’m not sure if I’d lump Taylor into the I’m-amazing-and-I-don’t-need-anyone group. As a long-time listener and fan, I may be biased! But I do think she’s always been a fan of marriage and it’s something she’s always longed for, right from her teenage years.
I see your Me! and I raise you ‘propecy’ (longing for a forever person), ‘ttpd’ (mocking marriage makes her heart explode), ‘so long London’ (‘I died on the altar waiting for the proof’) among many others.
Totally. I'm speaking in super broad strokes about what I guess could be called "girlboss pop", for lack of a better word. No one pop star fits perfectly into it, but it has been the ambient mood of music for women, even across genres.
I wouldn't put Lana in that camp at all. Desperate longing is kind of her whole thing. "And if this is the end / I want a boyfriend." (Lol.) I think Taylor has definitely capitalized on the moment, the trends of independence and autonomy. But there's absolutely longing there too. These women are maturing alongside their target demographic.
I think 2 pop diva that weren’t mentioned that’s really oddly situated in culture for the last 15 years is Beyoncé and Adele. I’d argue that Beyoncé’s music got significantly better *after* she got married. Her music and albums around love and marriage have been incredibly earnest, and while she’s often coded as progressive, the underlying music tends to be incredibly traditional in the defense of the institution of marriage (single ladies is such a funny song). Indeed the album Lemonade is ultimately about a couple overcoming infidelity and reforging the marriage contract, which is an explicit rejection of the “girl boss independent” tone of music
Adele also has produced incredibly earnest music. It’s not just she experiences heartbreak, it’s that she seems genuinely hurt and yearns for love. I suppose it’s why Beyoncé and Adele are deeply popular and yet somehow feel outside of the mainstream
Great points. Lemonade was huge and so original. And yes, both massive artists with wide appeal but feel less zeitgeisty today and too big to fail in some ways. Like on another level (Taylor too arguably).
I feel like Adele could do so much more with her music. She has the most incredible voice but the music itself is so… limp
I’d think for Adele, she has a formula and sticks to it, which is a shame because it would so much fun to see what kind of music she could make. It doesn’t have to pure pop, but a more Burt Bacharach/Hal David/Dion Warwick affair
Gaga is a really interesting callout as she also recently got engaged. From my perspective--making broad generalizations that obviously can't include every song she's ever written--she doesn't really speak about womanhood or the female experience in the way these other artists do. Young women don't listen to Gaga, not like they did in the late aughts / early 2010s. Nothing about her is "relatable," and I think that's obviously intentional. She is about FAME and performance. Every public appearance is so curated, and she's deeply ironic, exaggerated, self-aware, and shocking in that performance (see: meat dress). Undeniably iconic, talented, etc., but I didn't think MAYHEM was that great, "Abracadabra" was particularly brutal. Not sure where she goes from here, but I'll be def watching
Good insight. Gaga is like, queen mother for us gays and she’s had some difficulty navigating music. I think she’s stuck in being the personification of FAME and appealing to increasingly niche audience, that doesn’t seem to like her other musical ventures outside the aggressive club-pop. It’s a shame really because she’s genuinely talented and has a top notched voice.
I think she should excitement more, maybe do a 70s infused donna summers disco album or a crazy haired stadium rock ep
I put gaga/Arianna/Rihanna in the same class as the other artist that were mentioned in the piece - great artist to be sure, but very much bought the 2010s ethos of singing, ironically about love. Of course this isn’t necessarily 100% true - Joanne was an album that was an attempt at earnestness that was received poorly, and Ariana and Rihanna both have albums that take some creative licenses.
This truly resonates with me. Nothing matters more than free will — whether to marry or not, the power lies in choosing consciously, beyond the narratives society imposes. Thank you for this piece; I loved it so much I even had it translated into Chinese to share with my Mandarin-speaking circle.^^
wait so true... I really don't think of her as driving contemporary pop music, she's more of a actress/entrepreneur/beauty mogul in my mind, but this further proves the point!
loveeee the nuance in this piece! i feel like there are too many broad arguments that ignore the life transitions and emotional nuance you so beautifully capture in this piece!!
A lovely read and a different perspective on what I’ve viewed as the rise of traditionalism in line with politics. But, put this way, when you outline their successes and how their personas differ to their personal lives, how they truly don’t need to get married and something else is at play (love), it helped frame it so differently for me - thank you!
To add to your list at the end: I am addicted to the Catholic easy listening station and am telling you that the Carpenters' "I Believe You" is a corny, beautiful and criminally underrated song which expresses precisely what you are talking about and I cry a little every time I hear the final stanza
I believe you
When you say you'll fill my body with your soul
And love will grow into a freckled little girl
Who looks like we do
Baby, I believe you
Baby, I believe you
Honey, I love you
This is what we are ready for and need, my friends. And I'm seeing it start to happen with my college aged daughters who are, let's say, coming around on the idea of love and marriage now that they've met wonderful young men unlike the chuds they disdained in high school.
So well-said as always Catherine - and I think you are right about the cultural moment. I’m sorry for being such a dork about teen dramas (it’s who I am) but I sensed this too when Outer Banks had a very positive young marriage and pregnancy love story. People on Reddit complain about it but I think people are hungry for stories of vulnerable love.
Also - Lord help us, I’ve been away from Manhattan too long. Bermuda shorts?!
"People are hungry for stories of vulnerable love" -- couldn't agree more. In our broken world, something is bound to shift for the better. And yeah I've only seen them on a handful of occasions... but capri pants back in a big way. What's really bizarre is the big men's basketball shorts with cowboy boots
Love this take and it feels aligned to something I’ve been noodling on - that it’s suddenly cool to try again. Or that being seen trying is no longer like being seen with your pants down in public
Thank you for writing the one newsletter on Taylor’s engagement that I didn’t feel like cringing away from.
A thought I wanted to share – I’m not sure if I’d lump Taylor into the I’m-amazing-and-I-don’t-need-anyone group. As a long-time listener and fan, I may be biased! But I do think she’s always been a fan of marriage and it’s something she’s always longed for, right from her teenage years.
I see your Me! and I raise you ‘propecy’ (longing for a forever person), ‘ttpd’ (mocking marriage makes her heart explode), ‘so long London’ (‘I died on the altar waiting for the proof’) among many others.
Totally. I'm speaking in super broad strokes about what I guess could be called "girlboss pop", for lack of a better word. No one pop star fits perfectly into it, but it has been the ambient mood of music for women, even across genres.
I wouldn't put Lana in that camp at all. Desperate longing is kind of her whole thing. "And if this is the end / I want a boyfriend." (Lol.) I think Taylor has definitely capitalized on the moment, the trends of independence and autonomy. But there's absolutely longing there too. These women are maturing alongside their target demographic.
I think 2 pop diva that weren’t mentioned that’s really oddly situated in culture for the last 15 years is Beyoncé and Adele. I’d argue that Beyoncé’s music got significantly better *after* she got married. Her music and albums around love and marriage have been incredibly earnest, and while she’s often coded as progressive, the underlying music tends to be incredibly traditional in the defense of the institution of marriage (single ladies is such a funny song). Indeed the album Lemonade is ultimately about a couple overcoming infidelity and reforging the marriage contract, which is an explicit rejection of the “girl boss independent” tone of music
Adele also has produced incredibly earnest music. It’s not just she experiences heartbreak, it’s that she seems genuinely hurt and yearns for love. I suppose it’s why Beyoncé and Adele are deeply popular and yet somehow feel outside of the mainstream
Great points. Lemonade was huge and so original. And yes, both massive artists with wide appeal but feel less zeitgeisty today and too big to fail in some ways. Like on another level (Taylor too arguably).
I feel like Adele could do so much more with her music. She has the most incredible voice but the music itself is so… limp
I’d think for Adele, she has a formula and sticks to it, which is a shame because it would so much fun to see what kind of music she could make. It doesn’t have to pure pop, but a more Burt Bacharach/Hal David/Dion Warwick affair
Dion Warwick vibe yesssss
Interesting also that Gaga is not part of this conversation - do you see her as not being a part of this ‘younger’ pop cycle - excluding LDR?
Gaga is a really interesting callout as she also recently got engaged. From my perspective--making broad generalizations that obviously can't include every song she's ever written--she doesn't really speak about womanhood or the female experience in the way these other artists do. Young women don't listen to Gaga, not like they did in the late aughts / early 2010s. Nothing about her is "relatable," and I think that's obviously intentional. She is about FAME and performance. Every public appearance is so curated, and she's deeply ironic, exaggerated, self-aware, and shocking in that performance (see: meat dress). Undeniably iconic, talented, etc., but I didn't think MAYHEM was that great, "Abracadabra" was particularly brutal. Not sure where she goes from here, but I'll be def watching
Good insight. Gaga is like, queen mother for us gays and she’s had some difficulty navigating music. I think she’s stuck in being the personification of FAME and appealing to increasingly niche audience, that doesn’t seem to like her other musical ventures outside the aggressive club-pop. It’s a shame really because she’s genuinely talented and has a top notched voice.
I think she should excitement more, maybe do a 70s infused donna summers disco album or a crazy haired stadium rock ep
I put gaga/Arianna/Rihanna in the same class as the other artist that were mentioned in the piece - great artist to be sure, but very much bought the 2010s ethos of singing, ironically about love. Of course this isn’t necessarily 100% true - Joanne was an album that was an attempt at earnestness that was received poorly, and Ariana and Rihanna both have albums that take some creative licenses.
Here’s hoping Taylor Swift’s wedding is broadcast live on ESPN
This truly resonates with me. Nothing matters more than free will — whether to marry or not, the power lies in choosing consciously, beyond the narratives society imposes. Thank you for this piece; I loved it so much I even had it translated into Chinese to share with my Mandarin-speaking circle.^^
I love that please report back with their thoughts
不好意思，中文版在哪里？
To add to this theory, there is a new Raye single literally called "Where Is My Husband!"
And Selena Gomez!
wait so true... I really don't think of her as driving contemporary pop music, she's more of a actress/entrepreneur/beauty mogul in my mind, but this further proves the point!
"Maybe we will learn that stability and love do not destroy art, but serve as its foundation." Dolly parton is a great example of this. <3
loveeee the nuance in this piece! i feel like there are too many broad arguments that ignore the life transitions and emotional nuance you so beautifully capture in this piece!!
Thank you so much!!
A lovely read and a different perspective on what I’ve viewed as the rise of traditionalism in line with politics. But, put this way, when you outline their successes and how their personas differ to their personal lives, how they truly don’t need to get married and something else is at play (love), it helped frame it so differently for me - thank you!
To add to your list at the end: I am addicted to the Catholic easy listening station and am telling you that the Carpenters' "I Believe You" is a corny, beautiful and criminally underrated song which expresses precisely what you are talking about and I cry a little every time I hear the final stanza
I believe you
When you say you'll fill my body with your soul
And love will grow into a freckled little girl
Who looks like we do
Baby, I believe you
Baby, I believe you
Honey, I love you
This is what we are ready for and need, my friends. And I'm seeing it start to happen with my college aged daughters who are, let's say, coming around on the idea of love and marriage now that they've met wonderful young men unlike the chuds they disdained in high school.
So well-said as always Catherine - and I think you are right about the cultural moment. I’m sorry for being such a dork about teen dramas (it’s who I am) but I sensed this too when Outer Banks had a very positive young marriage and pregnancy love story. People on Reddit complain about it but I think people are hungry for stories of vulnerable love.
Also - Lord help us, I’ve been away from Manhattan too long. Bermuda shorts?!
"People are hungry for stories of vulnerable love" -- couldn't agree more. In our broken world, something is bound to shift for the better. And yeah I've only seen them on a handful of occasions... but capri pants back in a big way. What's really bizarre is the big men's basketball shorts with cowboy boots
Worthy of Dorothy Parker!
Love this take and it feels aligned to something I’ve been noodling on - that it’s suddenly cool to try again. Or that being seen trying is no longer like being seen with your pants down in public
Have you considered going into music writing? This is coming from a music journalist.
Maybe now haha, I'm flattered! Thanks for reading :)
I love this so much!
This was an interesting read and I think you’re on to something here! Thank you for sharing